From Caitrina at shaw.ca Tue May 21 08:11:04 2013 From: Caitrina at shaw.ca (Caitrina inghean Aindriasa) Date: Tue, 21 May 2013 08:11:04 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] New Red Flame Herald! Message-ID: <519B8E88.3010602@shaw.ca> Greetings Tir Righ! We have a new Red Flame Herald! Please help me in welcoming Lady Alivia Spencer who has graciously accepted the role to be the next Submissions Herald for Tir Righ. HUZZAH! To Alicia Red Flame a well deserved rest. You have done your College proud and we would not be where we are today without your continued hard work and service to our submitters. Thank you so much for being you. In Service, Caitrina Hafoc -- "Quarterly gules and sable, a winged fox sejant argent." From bear_necessities at telus.net Tue May 21 12:03:55 2013 From: bear_necessities at telus.net (Morel Carr Zupanic) Date: Tue, 21 May 2013 12:03:55 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] [northern] New Red Flame Herald! In-Reply-To: <519B8E88.3010602@shaw.ca> References: <519B8E88.3010602@shaw.ca> Message-ID: Caitrina Hafoc wrote: We have a new Red Flame Herald! Please help me in welcoming Lady Alivia Spencer who has graciously accepted the role to be the next Submissions Herald for Tir Righ. HUZZAH! *************************** Huzzah!! Thank you Lady Alivia, and thanks so much to Mistress Alicia for your hard work and wonderful service! Many thanks to Caitrina Hafoc for taking care of this matter, and getting this office filled. Doireann Dechti From Caitrina at shaw.ca Thu May 23 22:41:25 2013 From: Caitrina at shaw.ca (Caitrina inghean Aindriasa) Date: Thu, 23 May 2013 22:41:25 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Introducing your next Silver Yale Herald Message-ID: <519EFD85.7010800@shaw.ca> Greetings Tir Righ! First I would like to share with everyone that we had three.... THREE... applications for this office! HUZZAH! It warms me heart to see people willing to step in help our College and Principality. I'm a very happy Hafoc Herald. It gives me great pleasure to announce that your next Silver Yale Herald will be HL Vladimir Andreivich Aleksandrov from the Shire of Ramsgaard. Some may remember him as the Northern Regional Herald or the Cold Keep Herald. He has served as both voice and armorial Herald over the years while doing commentary on submissions as well as serving as staff/deputy to past Sanguinarius and Lions Blood Heralds. I know like myself, our College is very eager to welcome him back into the fold. Swearing in ceremony will take place at Coronet. Please join me in welcoming Vlad and a joyous noise to all the applicants. HUZZAH!! In Service, Caitrina Hafoc -- "Quarterly gules and sable, a winged fox sejant argent." From jdharcus at telus.net Fri May 24 08:20:37 2013 From: jdharcus at telus.net (Judy Harcus) Date: Fri, 24 May 2013 08:20:37 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Introducing your next Silver Yale Herald In-Reply-To: <519EFD85.7010800@shaw.ca> References: <519EFD85.7010800@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <519F8545.7020407@telus.net> Welcome Vlad! I look forward to working with you. Alicia Red Flame Caitrina inghean Aindriasa wrote: > Greetings Tir Righ! > > First I would like to share with everyone that we had three.... > THREE... applications for this office! HUZZAH! It warms me heart to > see people willing to step in help our College and Principality. I'm a > very happy Hafoc Herald. > > It gives me great pleasure to announce that your next Silver Yale > Herald will be HL Vladimir Andreivich Aleksandrov from the Shire of > Ramsgaard. Some may remember him as the Northern Regional Herald or > the Cold Keep Herald. He has served as both voice and armorial Herald > over the years while doing commentary on submissions as well as > serving as staff/deputy to past Sanguinarius and Lions Blood Heralds. > I know like myself, our College is very eager to welcome him back into > the fold. Swearing in ceremony will take place at Coronet. Please > join me in welcoming Vlad and a joyous noise to all the applicants. > HUZZAH!! > > In Service, > > Caitrina Hafoc > From archerychik at gmail.com Fri May 24 11:00:18 2013 From: archerychik at gmail.com (Allison Mail) Date: Fri, 24 May 2013 11:00:18 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] [northern] Introducing your next Silver Yale Herald In-Reply-To: <519EFD85.7010800@shaw.ca> References: <519EFD85.7010800@shaw.ca> Message-ID: Welcome Vlad! Aline Black Adderbolt Sent from my iPad On 2013-05-23, at 10:41 PM, Caitrina inghean Aindriasa wrote: > Greetings Tir Righ! > > First I would like to share with everyone that we had three.... THREE... applications for this office! HUZZAH! It warms me heart to see people willing to step in help our College and Principality. I'm a very happy Hafoc Herald. > > It gives me great pleasure to announce that your next Silver Yale Herald will be HL Vladimir Andreivich Aleksandrov from the Shire of Ramsgaard. Some may remember him as the Northern Regional Herald or the Cold Keep Herald. He has served as both voice and armorial Herald over the years while doing commentary on submissions as well as serving as staff/deputy to past Sanguinarius and Lions Blood Heralds. I know like myself, our College is very eager to welcome him back into the fold. Swearing in ceremony will take place at Coronet. Please join me in welcoming Vlad and a joyous noise to all the applicants. HUZZAH!! > > In Service, > > Caitrina Hafoc > > -- > "Quarterly gules and sable, a winged fox sejant argent." > > > _______________________________________________ > northern mailing list > northern at antir.sca.org > http://antir.sca.org/mailman/listinfo/northern_antir.sca.org From youngrocketsamurai at gmail.com Fri May 24 15:26:35 2013 From: youngrocketsamurai at gmail.com (Michael Chorney) Date: Fri, 24 May 2013 15:26:35 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] [northern] Introducing your next Silver Yale Herald In-Reply-To: References: <519EFD85.7010800@shaw.ca> Message-ID: Thanks for the warm welcome, everyone. I look forward to working with and getting to know you all better. On Fri, May 24, 2013 at 11:00 AM, Allison Mail wrote: > Welcome Vlad! > Aline Black Adderbolt > > Sent from my iPad > > On 2013-05-23, at 10:41 PM, Caitrina inghean Aindriasa > wrote: > > > Greetings Tir Righ! > > > > First I would like to share with everyone that we had three.... THREE... > applications for this office! HUZZAH! It warms me heart to see people > willing to step in help our College and Principality. I'm a very happy > Hafoc Herald. > > > > It gives me great pleasure to announce that your next Silver Yale Herald > will be HL Vladimir Andreivich Aleksandrov from the Shire of Ramsgaard. > Some may remember him as the Northern Regional Herald or the Cold Keep > Herald. He has served as both voice and armorial Herald over the years > while doing commentary on submissions as well as serving as staff/deputy to > past Sanguinarius and Lions Blood Heralds. I know like myself, our College > is very eager to welcome him back into the fold. Swearing in ceremony will > take place at Coronet. Please join me in welcoming Vlad and a joyous noise > to all the applicants. HUZZAH!! > > > > In Service, > > > > Caitrina Hafoc > > > > -- > > "Quarterly gules and sable, a winged fox sejant argent." > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > northern mailing list > > northern at antir.sca.org > > http://antir.sca.org/mailman/listinfo/northern_antir.sca.org > > =============================================== > Principality of Tir Righ College of Heralds mailing list > Unsubscribe: collegeofheralds-unsubscribe at tirrigh.org > Help: collegeofheralds-request at tirrigh.org, subject line "help" > (without quotes) > or http://mail.tirrigh.org/mailman/listinfo/collegeofheralds_tirrigh.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From runescope at shaw.ca Tue May 28 11:00:49 2013 From: runescope at shaw.ca (Runescope) Date: Tue, 28 May 2013 11:00:49 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Received AoA, now I need CoA Message-ID: <000301ce5bcd$49b31720$dd194560$@shaw.ca> Greetings unto the Lists! I'm not sure if this made it onto the lists yesterday, if it did, my apologies for a repost :) A couple of years ago, I received my Award of Arms, and I?ve finally gotten around to designing a (VERY) preliminary Coat of Arms.? I?ve been told that this is the place to request help for design and approval.? I?m pretty sure I can?t post an image to the list, but this link will take you to an image of my first draft. Any and all, critiques and comments welcome! http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7365/8860694446_2bfafe55da_o.jpg ?Gerry Harris aka ?Runescope? aka Thane Greyhaven The Single Minded Schizophrenic, The Original Unified Committee The Master of the Brief Infinity, Or was that the Infinity Briefs? This and all other notifications shall not be misconstrued as an alien invasion, unless said notification is specifically notarized as being an actual alien invasion. Interested in the Distant Past, and the Far Future runescope at shaw.ca runepod at gmail.com runescope at hotmail.com runepad at gmail.com From jdharcus at telus.net Tue May 28 23:14:12 2013 From: jdharcus at telus.net (Judy Harcus) Date: Tue, 28 May 2013 23:14:12 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Received AoA, now I need CoA In-Reply-To: <000301ce5bcd$49b31720$dd194560$@shaw.ca> References: <000301ce5bcd$49b31720$dd194560$@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <51A59CB4.2030404@telus.net> Greetings, The Tir Righ College of Heralds will be most happy to assist you with your heraldry. First, though, I should mention (in case you are not already aware of this) that you will need to register your name in addition to your arms as all heraldic registrations are tied to the primary registered name. Having your name on the Order of Precedence or a membership card is different from having it registered. We can assist you with this as well. I am a bit worried about your first name, Thane. 'Thegn' is an alternate title for a Viscount and thus cannot be registered as a name unless you are a Viscount. However I'm not sure whether this spelling is also reserved or not, but that can be checked. As for your preliminary device (arms), this has some problems in terms of acceptable style. 1) There are specific heraldic 'tinctures' that were used for medieval heraldry which you are limited to, which are the 'colors' red, blue, green, black and purple and the 'metals' white and yellow. Except in some rare cases, you can only put a 'metal' charge (your tower, swords, etc. are charges) on a 'color' field (the background) or a 'color' charge on a 'metal' field. Therefore, the background on the top part cannot be grey is not a heraldic tincture. As your tower is white (a metal), the field it is on should be a color (red, blue, green, black or purple). Your swords are white on a white field which provides no contrast at all (they will be impossible to see in any dim light) and should also be on a color field. 2) You have three different types of charges of approximately equal importance on the field (which puts them in the same 'charge group'). This wasn't done in medieval heraldry (our term for this is 'slot machine' armory). No more than two different types of charges are allowed in the same charge group. (Note: if, for example, you had the crossed swords in the center and three smaller towers surrounding it, than you would have two different charge groups - the tower being the primary charge group and the towers in a secondary charge group. This is also relevant to the next comment. 3) All three sections have different combinations charges. The tower is a single element, the skull and crossbones are two bones in saltire surmounted by the skull, and the sword are in saltire but not surmounted by anything so each has to be described separately. This runs into a problem with section A3D2c of the Standards for Evaluation (the rules governing allowable styles as well as conflict rules) which states that "A charge group in which postures for different charges must be blazoned individually will not be allowed without period examples of that combination of postures." 4) I believe there is a restriction on the use of a skull and crossbones but I would have to check that. 5) A minor point - the horizontal line across the center should be higher so the space above and below the line is more equal. In period, your arms wasn't telling a story about you, which is what I think you're trying to do. It would be best to simplify. If you can let us know what is the most important charge(s), maybe we can offer some suggestions. Also, let me know if you don't understand any of the above information. In service, Alicia le Wilfulle Red Flame Herald Runescope wrote: >Greetings unto the Lists! > >I'm not sure if this made it onto the lists yesterday, if it did, my >apologies for a repost :) > > >A couple of years ago, I received my Award of Arms, and I?ve finally gotten >around to designing a (VERY) preliminary Coat of Arms. > >I?ve been told that this is the place to request help for design and >approval. I?m pretty sure I can?t post an image to the list, but this link >will take you to an image of my first draft. > >Any and all, critiques and comments welcome! > >http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7365/8860694446_2bfafe55da_o.jpg > > > > > Gerry Harris aka ?Runescope? aka Thane Greyhaven > >The Single Minded Schizophrenic, The Original Unified Committee >The Master of the Brief Infinity, ? Or was that the Infinity Briefs? ? > >This and all other notifications shall not be misconstrued as an alien >invasion, unless said notification is specifically notarized as being an >actual alien invasion. > >Interested in the Distant Past, and the Far Future >runescope at shaw.ca runepod at gmail.com runescope at hotmail.com runepad at gmail.com > > > > > >=============================================== >Principality of Tir Righ College of Heralds mailing list >Unsubscribe: collegeofheralds-unsubscribe at tirrigh.org > Help: collegeofheralds-request at tirrigh.org, subject line "help" (without quotes) >or http://mail.tirrigh.org/mailman/listinfo/collegeofheralds_tirrigh.org > > >----- >No virus found in this message. >Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >Version: 2013.0.2904 / Virus Database: 3162/6330 - Release Date: 05/16/13 >Internal Virus Database is out of date. > > > > > From BasilD at lavabit.com Tue May 28 23:57:37 2013 From: BasilD at lavabit.com (Basil) Date: Tue, 28 May 2013 23:57:37 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Received AoA, now I need CoA In-Reply-To: <51A59CB4.2030404@telus.net> References: <000301ce5bcd$49b31720$dd194560$@shaw.ca> <51A59CB4.2030404@telus.net> Message-ID: <51A5A6E1.1050500@lavabit.com> On 5/28/2013 11:14 PM, Judy Harcus wrote: > Greetings, > > The Tir Righ College of Heralds will be most happy to assist you with > your heraldry. > > First, though, I should mention (in case you are not already aware of > this) that you will need to register your name in addition to your > arms as all heraldic registrations are tied to the primary registered > name. Having your name on the Order of Precedence or a membership card > is different from having it registered. We can assist you with this as > well. I am a bit worried about your first name, Thane. 'Thegn' is an > alternate title for a Viscount and thus cannot be registered as a name > unless you are a Viscount. However I'm not sure whether this spelling > is also reserved or not, but that can be checked. > > As for your preliminary device (arms), this has some problems in terms > of acceptable style. > 1) There are specific heraldic 'tinctures' that were used for medieval > heraldry which you are limited to, which are the 'colors' red, blue, > green, black and purple and the 'metals' white and yellow. Except in > some rare cases, you can only put a 'metal' charge (your tower, > swords, etc. are charges) on a 'color' field (the background) or a > 'color' charge on a 'metal' field. > > Therefore, the background on the top part cannot be grey is not a > heraldic tincture. As your tower is white (a metal), the field it is > on should be a color (red, blue, green, black or purple). Your swords > are white on a white field which provides no contrast at all (they > will be impossible to see in any dim light) and should also be on a > color field. > > 2) You have three different types of charges of approximately equal > importance on the field (which puts them in the same 'charge group'). > This wasn't done in medieval heraldry (our term for this is 'slot > machine' armory). No more than two different types of charges are > allowed in the same charge group. (Note: if, for example, you had the > crossed swords in the center and three smaller towers surrounding it, > than you would have two different charge groups - the tower being the > primary charge group and the towers in a secondary charge group. This > is also relevant to the next comment. > > 3) All three sections have different combinations charges. The tower > is a single element, the skull and crossbones are two bones in saltire > surmounted by the skull, and the sword are in saltire but not > surmounted by anything so each has to be described separately. This > runs into a problem with section A3D2c of the Standards for Evaluation > (the rules governing allowable styles as well as conflict rules) which > states that "A charge group in which postures for different charges > must be blazoned individually will not be allowed without period > examples of that combination of postures." > > 4) I believe there is a restriction on the use of a skull and > crossbones but I would have to check that. > > 5) A minor point - the horizontal line across the center should be > higher so the space above and below the line is more equal. > > In period, your arms wasn't telling a story about you, which is what I > think you're trying to do. It would be best to simplify. If you can > let us know what is the most important charge(s), maybe we can offer > some suggestions. Also, let me know if you don't understand any of the > above information. > > In service, > Alicia le Wilfulle > Red Flame Herald Also please note that the SCA doesn't register mottoes, so the ribbons and the stuff on them should be dropped. -- ~~Basil Dragonstrike Every dream has a blind side, a trapdoor that's tripped by doubt. -- Webb Wilder, "The Rest (Will Take Care of Itself)" So, flying up in a human-rated Dragon (spaceship) is not gonna be an issue. -- astronaut Don Pettit Er? m?tis cum sim mortuus. Peritia zmaragdus est; sapientia adam?s est. Compar?vistine impensae e?rum n?per? And it's only the giving that makes you, what you are. -- J. Tull There IS more than one way to skin a cat, but they all leave you with a dead cat. -- B. Dragonstrike THIS LIFE IS ONLY A TEST. In the event of a Real Life you would be told where to go and what to do. THIS IS A TEST. REPEAT: THIS IS ONLY A TEST. Disobedience is Mandatory! A soft answer may turn aside wrath, but for stupidity you sometimes need a stick. Tho' logic choppers rule the town And every man and maid and boy has marked a distant object down. "An aimless joy is a pure joy." Or so did Tom O'Reily say, Who saw the surges running by, "And wisdom is a butterfly, And not a gloomy bird of prey." From jdharcus at telus.net Wed May 29 09:45:39 2013 From: jdharcus at telus.net (Judy Harcus) Date: Wed, 29 May 2013 09:45:39 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Received AoA, now I need CoA In-Reply-To: <51A5A6E1.1050500@lavabit.com> References: <000301ce5bcd$49b31720$dd194560$@shaw.ca> <51A59CB4.2030404@telus.net> <51A5A6E1.1050500@lavabit.com> Message-ID: <51A630B3.3060706@telus.net> Basil wrote: > > Also please note that the SCA doesn't register mottoes, so the ribbons > and the stuff on them should be dropped. > > Basil is correct - we only register the device itself. You can use the banners, but it isn't part of your registration. Alicia Red Flame From youngrocketsamurai at gmail.com Wed May 29 16:22:31 2013 From: youngrocketsamurai at gmail.com (Michael Chorney) Date: Wed, 29 May 2013 16:22:31 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Received AoA, now I need CoA In-Reply-To: <000301ce5bcd$49b31720$dd194560$@shaw.ca> References: <000301ce5bcd$49b31720$dd194560$@shaw.ca> Message-ID: Greetings, Thane! Congratulations on your AA, and also on making the most excellent decision to design your armoury and get it registered! As Alicia has mentioned, your current idea is a little on the busy side, but I'm sure we can work on that. Why don't you tell us a little about why you chose the elements you selected, and if/why they are important to you? If one of the items on your suggested device is more critical to you, we can focus on that as a design motif. When designing armoury, you ideally want it to be simple and clean. Remember, the idea is for it to be easily identifiable and recognizeable at a distance. The more cluttered it is, the harder that it to do. Also, as mentioned, there is going to be an issue with your name. Would you be happy with something that sounded similar? Whereabouts are you? Maybe we can find a local herald that you can work with face-to-face, that can help you with all that stuff. Not that we aren't happy to assist here, just that it is always easier to work with someone in person. As for the motto and such - this kind of stuff is fantastic, and I greatly encourage its use, but it won't be part of your submission or registered arms. That doesn't mean don't use it - absolutely do! But your submission will consist of your name and your device alone. I hope this was helpful. If you have any more questions, don't hesitate to ask! That's what we're here for. In service, Vladimir Andreivich Aleksandrov (almost-but-not-quite-yet) Silver Yale Herald On Tue, May 28, 2013 at 11:00 AM, Runescope wrote: > Greetings unto the Lists! > > I'm not sure if this made it onto the lists yesterday, if it did, my > apologies for a repost :) > > > A couple of years ago, I received my Award of Arms, and I?ve finally gotten > around to designing a (VERY) preliminary Coat of Arms. > > I?ve been told that this is the place to request help for design and > approval. I?m pretty sure I can?t post an image to the list, but this link > will take you to an image of my first draft. > > Any and all, critiques and comments welcome! > > http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7365/8860694446_2bfafe55da_o.jpg > > > > > Gerry Harris aka ?Runescope? aka Thane Greyhaven > > The Single Minded Schizophrenic, The Original Unified Committee > The Master of the Brief Infinity, ? Or was that the Infinity Briefs? ? > > This and all other notifications shall not be misconstrued as an alien > invasion, unless said notification is specifically notarized as being an > actual alien invasion. > > Interested in the Distant Past, and the Far Future > runescope at shaw.ca runepod at gmail.com runescope at hotmail.com > runepad at gmail.com > > > > > > =============================================== > Principality of Tir Righ College of Heralds mailing list > Unsubscribe: collegeofheralds-unsubscribe at tirrigh.org > Help: collegeofheralds-request at tirrigh.org, subject line "help" > (without quotes) > or http://mail.tirrigh.org/mailman/listinfo/collegeofheralds_tirrigh.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From BasilD at lavabit.com Wed May 29 17:34:41 2013 From: BasilD at lavabit.com (Basil) Date: Wed, 29 May 2013 17:34:41 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Received AoA, now I need CoA In-Reply-To: <51A59CB4.2030404@telus.net> References: <000301ce5bcd$49b31720$dd194560$@shaw.ca> <51A59CB4.2030404@telus.net> Message-ID: <51A69EA1.5000901@lavabit.com> As a follow-up: On 5/28/2013 11:14 PM, Judy Harcus wrote: > > 4) I believe there is a restriction on the use of a skull and > crossbones but I would have to check that. The only precedent I can find is: "[Quarterly gules and sable, in pale a jawless skull and a pair of cutlasses in saltire argent.] This violates RfS VIII.4, Obtrusive Modernity, and specifically VIII.4.b, Modern Insignia. VIII.4.b states 'Overt allusions to modern insignia, trademarks, or common designs may not be registered.' VIII.4 states that '"modern" is defined as anything outside the period of the Society.' It was the overwhelming opinion of the College that this motif is too reminiscent of pirate designs featuring a skull above crossed items (typically bones or cutlasses) that go back only to the early 18th century. In particular (as noted by Palmer), John 'Calico Jack' Rackham (hanged for a pirate in 1720) was reported to fly Sable, in pale a skull and a pair of cutlasses in saltire argent. Laurel precedent has held that 'A name that, by its very presence, destroys any medieval ambience is not a name we should register.' (Porsche Audi, August 1992, p.28) The same applies to armory, and designs such as this almost inevitably generate thoughts of post-period pirates, which likewise 'destroy any medieval ambience'. (We do not dispute the presence in period of those who practiced piracy or something closely akin to it. That is not the point.) [Alastair Corran, LoAR 06/2004, East-R]" Thus, while only skull & cutlasses was ruled on, skull & bones is clearly referenced. I, too, believe a skull and bones would not be registered. ~~Basil Dragonstrike Er? m?tis cum sim mortuus. And it's only the giving that makes you, what you are. -- J. Tull Disobedience is Mandatory! From jdharcus at telus.net Wed May 29 22:21:00 2013 From: jdharcus at telus.net (Judy Harcus) Date: Wed, 29 May 2013 22:21:00 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Received AoA, now I need CoA In-Reply-To: <51A69EA1.5000901@lavabit.com> References: <000301ce5bcd$49b31720$dd194560$@shaw.ca> <51A59CB4.2030404@telus.net> <51A69EA1.5000901@lavabit.com> Message-ID: <51A6E1BC.6000103@telus.net> Thanks for finding that, Basil. I think that's the ruling I was remembering. Alicia Red Flame Basil wrote: > As a follow-up: > > On 5/28/2013 11:14 PM, Judy Harcus wrote: > >> >> 4) I believe there is a restriction on the use of a skull and >> crossbones but I would have to check that. > > > The only precedent I can find is: > "[Quarterly gules and sable, in pale a jawless skull and a pair of > cutlasses in saltire argent.] This violates RfS VIII.4, Obtrusive > Modernity, and specifically VIII.4.b, Modern Insignia. VIII.4.b states > 'Overt allusions to modern insignia, trademarks, or common designs may > not be registered.' VIII.4 states that '"modern" is defined as > anything outside the period of the Society.' It was the overwhelming > opinion of the College that this motif is too reminiscent of pirate > designs featuring a skull above crossed items (typically bones or > cutlasses) that go back only to the early 18th century. In particular > (as noted by Palmer), John 'Calico Jack' Rackham (hanged for a pirate > in 1720) was reported to fly Sable, in pale a skull and a pair of > cutlasses in saltire argent. Laurel precedent has held that 'A name > that, by its very presence, destroys any medieval ambience is not a > name we should register.' (Porsche Audi, August 1992, p.28) The same > applies to armory, and designs such as this almost inevitably generate > thoughts of post-period pirates, which likewise 'destroy any medieval > ambience'. (We do not dispute the presence in period of those who > practiced piracy or something closely akin to it. That is not the > point.) [Alastair Corran, LoAR 06/2004, East-R]" > > Thus, while only skull & cutlasses was ruled on, skull & bones is > clearly referenced. I, too, believe a skull and bones would not be > registered. > > > ~~Basil Dragonstrike > > Er? m?tis cum sim mortuus. > > And it's only the giving that makes you, what you are. -- J. Tull > > Disobedience is Mandatory! > > > =============================================== > Principality of Tir Righ College of Heralds mailing list > Unsubscribe: collegeofheralds-unsubscribe at tirrigh.org > Help: collegeofheralds-request at tirrigh.org, subject line "help" > (without quotes) > or http://mail.tirrigh.org/mailman/listinfo/collegeofheralds_tirrigh.org > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 2013.0.2904 / Virus Database: 3162/6330 - Release Date: 05/16/13 > Internal Virus Database is out of date. From dhrhodes58 at gmail.com Thu May 30 21:41:44 2013 From: dhrhodes58 at gmail.com (Darryl Rhodes) Date: Thu, 30 May 2013 21:41:44 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Device check. Message-ID: Greetings, Can someone within the college check this device to make sure that it conforms to the rules and doesn't have any conflicts. Thanks. Viscount Steinn -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Screen shot 2013-05-30 at 6.32.39 AM.png Type: image/png Size: 45324 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jdharcus at telus.net Fri May 31 09:42:35 2013 From: jdharcus at telus.net (Judy Harcus) Date: Fri, 31 May 2013 09:42:35 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Device check. Message-ID: <51A8D2FB.4090801@telus.net> Unfortunately, this design ("Quarterly Or and vert, in bend a cross [type?] gules and a wolf rampant sable") gives the appearance of 'marshalling' (combining two people's devices into one), which is not allowed. For more information on marshalling, see http://heraldry.sca.org/sena.html#PN4. This particular configuration can be found in section A.6.F.2. Designs which Create the Appearance of Marshalling subsection c. Multiple Types of Primary Charges which says: "When different sections of the field contain different types of charges, it creates the appearance of marshalling. For example, Quarterly gules and azure, in bend two crosses crosslet and in bend sinister two roses argent creates the appearance of marshalling, as does Quarterly vert and erminois, in bend a badger and a fleur-de-lys argent. Per pale argent and sable, a unicorn sable and a dragon Or combatant creates the appearance of marshalling. In each case, the different types of charges create the appearance of marshalling." Consider changing the line of division from quarterly to per saltire ('X' instead of '+') as that would eliminate any appearance of marshalling. The charges could then be in the top & bottom sections, or side by side. (I haven't conflict checked.) Also, I'm wondering if the slight flair at the ends of the cross may be an issue. I may be remembering incorrectly (and am unable to check at the moment), but I think there was a recent submission returned because of a similar cross that didn't fit any of the defined crosses. Hopefully someone else can confirm/deny this. In service, Alicia Red Flame Darryl Rhodes wrote: > Greetings, > > Can someone within the college check this device to make sure that it > conforms to the rules and doesn't have any conflicts. Thanks. > > Viscount Steinn > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From BasilD at lavabit.com Fri May 31 13:46:43 2013 From: BasilD at lavabit.com (Basil) Date: Fri, 31 May 2013 13:46:43 -0700 Subject: [tirrigh-heralds] Device check. In-Reply-To: <51A8D2FB.4090801@telus.net> References: <51A8D2FB.4090801@telus.net> Message-ID: <51A90C33.2010802@lavabit.com> On 5/31/2013 9:42 AM, Judy Harcus wrote: > Unfortunately, this design ("Quarterly Or and vert, in bend a cross > [type?] gules and a wolf rampant sable") gives the appearance of > 'marshalling' (combining two people's devices into one), which is not > allowed. > For more information on marshalling, see > http://heraldry.sca.org/sena.html#PN4. That should be http://heraldry.sca.org/sena.htm#A6 ;-) {snip} > Consider changing the line of division from quarterly to per saltire > ('X' instead of '+') as that would eliminate any appearance of > marshalling. The charges could then be in the top & bottom sections, > or side by side. (I haven't conflict checked.) Or you could change one or the other, or both, lines to something other than straight. > Also, I'm wondering if the slight flair at the ends of the cross may > be an issue. I may be remembering incorrectly (and am unable to check > at the moment), but I think there was a recent submission returned > because of a similar cross that didn't fit any of the defined crosses. > Hopefully someone else can confirm/deny this. Unfortunately, I can't find it. I'm also not sure if it was returned at kingdom or by the Laurel office. ~~Basil Dragonstrike Er? m?tis cum sim mortuus. There IS more than one way to skin a cat, but they all leave you with a dead cat. -- B. Dragonstrike A soft answer may turn aside wrath, but for stupidity you sometimes need a stick.